Our blog has a longer post on the subject, but the ultimate answer is that GPU mining is very insecure. For the vast majority of GPU mined coins out there (including Sia), it is the case that there are multiple, if not many, individuals who operate enough GPUs to execute a 51% attack against the coin all by themselves. There are some very large Ethereum GPU farms out there, and they are a threat to all small GPU-mined coins. (our market cap is a factor of 50 smaller than Ethereum - we are a small coin). And it's not just Ethereum farms to be afraid of, there are massive GPU farms dedicated to machine learning as well, and other big-data related use cases. All of those are potential sources for a 51% attack. Even worse, if the price of the coin tanks following such an attack, the attacker has nothing to lose, because the core purpose of their hardware is unrelated to Sia, and unaffected by a change in price. Though it sounds terrible and unintuitive, a single centralized entity running ASICs would be a much more secure situation than this. Because with a single central ASIC entity, you get two huge advantages:
There's only 1 entity capable of performing a 51% attack. This is much better than having multiple entities that are each individually capable of performing a 51% attack.
If the price of the coin falls, the entity that has all of the hardware loses a lot of money. That hardware isn't good for anything besides Sia mining, so that entity is quite invested in propping up the siacoin price.
We chose ASICs over GPUs because even the worst case scenario is more secure and better for the coin than the situation with GPU mining. But we also did not want a single entity owning and operating all of the ASICs. That's when we realized, if we were ASIC manufacturers ourselves, we could guarantee that at least one entity is selling chips to the larger community. The unfortunate fact is that either way, there is going to be a small number of chip manufacturers who have the power to sell chips to the community. Even so, this is a better situation than what you get with GPU mining. We are making ASICs so that we can guarantee the first batch of ASICs will make it to the Sia community. Without that, we have no idea if the first batch of ASICs will be sold to the public or hoarded by some greedy investors who were able to pay the full price of manufacturing up-front.
Why are you doing the presale so early?
We, put simply, don't have enough cash even to do the early development of the chips. We need financing to pay for chip development. Traditionally, we would find some private investors, have them front some millions, and in return promise them a very good deal on some hardware. The private investors would get the first stab at buying ASICs, they'd get a huge chunk, and they'd get them at an exclusive deal for taking on the risk early. We actually had private investors come forward offering this to us, with enough money to fund the full development and manufacture of the first batch of chips - this isn't a hypothetical, it's a real offer that the Sia team received. This didn't seem fair to us. When we finally did get to the point where the miners were ready to be sold to the community, we would have to offer the community a worse deal. Less risky, but ultimately it would mean that the community was excluded from the opportunity of participating early, and the result is a huge chunk of the chips going to some private investors. Such a situation is still better than GPU mining, but it didn't seem like the best that we could do. We felt that we could do better by opening the early presale to everyone.
Why not accept credit cards?
Payment processors are not friendly to Bitcoin products. We contacted Stripe and were told point-blank that they would not process payments for cryptocurrency miners. We appreciate everyone who pointed us towards Stripe as a bitcoin-friendly company, but they gave us a direct no. Paypal has a long history of freezing merchant accounts with little warning, and when they do so they freeze your existing money in addition to freezing incoming payments - we would be unable to pay our bills if Paypal did this to us, and it would unquestionably cause delays. Visa and MasterCard are not much better in terms of track record. Losing access to our accounts would unquestionably cause delays. ASIC hardware is already well known to suffer from serious delays, and we need to limit our exposure to delays. We are in an industry that is unfortunately fraught with fraud. With revenue-generated devices such as miners, criminals are much more likely to try to target these devices as a way to cash in on stolen credit cards, stolen identities, hacked bank accounts, etc. The fraud rates are staggering, and as a result most payment processors outright refuse to deal with it. We are aware that Bitmain is partnered with Paypal, though we don't know the details behind how that came to be.
Why not accept Siacoin?
This was a harder decision. We could quite easily choose to accept siacoin, however we fear that Siacoin is not ready to handle such a massive presale. The market cap and daily volume of Bitcoin is a factor of 100 times as large as the Siacoin market cap and volume. Moving millions or tens of millions of dollars through Bitcoin is not likely to make much of a dent. Siacoin on the other hand, a sudden sell order for millions of dollars would likely tank the price. That not only means the ecosystem is unhappy with us, it also means that we might only be able to sell $2499 of siacoin for $2200. A lot of people have accused us of not having confidence in our own coin. Unfortunately, this is true. Even at a $500 million market cap, Sia is not ready to handle a presale of this size. It's a pragmatic decision based on the fact that we don't want to dump our own coin. We know that people will be selling siacoin to buy the miners anyway, but we still feel that this situation is much better than us accepting siacoin directly. This decision was a disappointment for us as well. We would love to accept siacoin, and if we weren't talking about processing millions of dollars in a single day, we absolutely would be accepting siacoin. And, as Sia continues growing up, the concerns above will become less and less.
What about this 5% gains/losses stuff?
Our intention was never to play fishy financial games with our users, and honestly this isn't even something that crossed our minds as a potential problem point. I think a big part of the issue was that people did not realize we will be converting to US dollars as fast as possible - we will be doing the conversion in minutes or hours as long as we can keep up with the order volume. The rationale is very simple. If the price plummets before we are able to convert the Bitcoin, we won't have enough money to create the hardware. We really don't expect this to matter, because we don't expect the price to swing by more than $100 (which is what would be required) in the few hours that we're going to be sitting on the BTC. If it does, we'll need more coins or we can't produce the hardware - our costs are in dollars, which means we need to end up with the right amount of dollars in our account at the end of the day. The original stance on not returning gains was also very simple. There's no transparency into when we sell the coins. If we sell the coins within 60 minutes of receiving them, and then 4 hours later there's a huge surge in the price, we will almost certainly have users emailing us and posting about how we owe them a refund. We won't have that refund, because we'll have sold the coins before the price rise. There's not much we can do to provide transparency into this either. And we're likely to get requests for refunds even if it takes 3 months for Bitcoin to rise by 5%. This promise of returning gains that we've put forward is going to be a massive headache, because we're not expecting to have any gains, even if the price goes up by that much we'll have likely converted to USD faster than that. Our whole goal is to convert to USD as fast as possible. We're sorry that we have to go through this headache at all. If we could get set up with a processor like Stripe, we could accept both Bitcoin and USD and let them deal with the conversion process, slippage risk, and all the other headache associated with using multiple currencies.
Why shipping a full 12 months away?
Before we set out to make Sia miners, we did a study of companies who had previously sold and pre-sold Bitcoin miners. This included talking to both Avalon and Butterfly Labs, and talking to professionals and advisors who have shipped hardware successfully in other industries. The core piece of advice we got was pretty consistent: expect delays. Expect lots of delays, and expect them to come from the most absurd setbacks. (Example: one of the people we talked to had to delay their product because there was a global shortage of power supplies, and they had to wait in line behind billion dollar companies to get some). Our projections indicate that if all goes well, we should be able to ship the miners in 6-8 months. Nothing we are doing is new. Plenty of companies have gone through the process of developing a chip, manufacturing it, putting it in a box, and then shipping it to users. There is almost no innovation risk here. Sia's PoW algorithm is deliberately very ASIC friendly, even more than Bitcoin. We have advisors who have gone through this process before, and the types of challenges facing us are well known. 6-8 months is reasonable, except that every single person we've talked to has told us that unexpected delays is a guarantee, and that by nature of being unexpected, there's not really any way to prevent them by planning around them. Delays are just inherent to shipping hardware. So we chose to set our target at 12 months. We will ship the miners as soon as they are ready. If we are a few months ahead of schedule, and have somehow managed to avoid the foretold delays, we will ship them months ahead of schedule. But we want our users to have a realistic understanding of the expected delays. We've baked a generous amount of time for setbacks into our shipping date. We'll almost certainly need at least some of it.
Making chips is very expensive. We have to sell thousands of units to cover the cost of the chips. A nontrivial percentage of the price is going to go towards chassis, shipping, power supply, control board, fans, etc. Those costs are relatively the same even if we put in fewer chips, which means the total percentage of our budget going towards chips drops significantly. If we cut the price in half, we'll have to sell roughly three times as many units to break even on the cost of the chips. If we cut the price in half again, we'd need to sell a completely unreasonable number of units to break even on the cost of the chips. It's unfortunate, but the fixed costs of chip manufacture means that we really need vast majority of the price of the unit to be spent on chips, otherwise we simply won't be able to sell enough units. There is a second reason as well. As stated in the section above, the industry is plagued by delays an unexpected expenses. We need a healthy budget to plan around potential setbacks, because we've been guaranteed that there will be multiple significant setbacks by those who have gone through this process before. If we bring down the price of the unit, we will also be reducing the amount of wiggle room we have for disaster if suddenly we have to replace parts, re-do designs, or otherwise perform expensive adjustments to our plans.
Are you guys qualified to be working on hardware?
Zach is a mechanical engineer, I've been in the Bitcoin space since before ASICs started shipping, and we have advisors who have successfully shipped hardware before. The team that is designing the chips for the miner has designed chips and shipped chips for Bitcoin miners previously - they are familiar with the whole process, and have done it before. The people in charge of designing the PCB board and other aspects of the miner are also all experienced with their respective tasks. We will be facilitating frequent and strong communications between everyone working on the various components of the miner. The ultimate answer is that the Sia development team is not qualified to be making this type of hardware. However, the Sia development team is not the team working on the hardware. Most of the heavy lifting is being performed by teams with lots of experience in this industry, including experience that is directly related to cryptocurrency miners. What we are doing is not new. Dozens of cryptocurrency miners have been created and shipped in the past, and we are not starting from day zero. We have many advantages over the previous rounds of pre-sale cryptocurrency miners, but the biggest is that it's no longer the wild west of hardware design. There is a standard, and there are tried-and-true methods for making reliable cryptocurrency miners. We get to fall back on the mistakes and successes of the many miners that have been built previously, and we will be leaning heavily on teams and people that have direct experience in this field as opposed to doing everything ourselves.
Does this mean that Sia is getting less attention from the developers?
Sia right now has four full time employees. Myself, Zach, Luke, and Johnathan. Zach was hired in June 2017, less than one month ago. He is not a programmer. Luke and Johnathan will continue with the same responsibilities that they've always had. They helped out a little bit in setting up the website, and in setting up a secure database to process orders + payment information, however the majority of their time has been focused on Sia even as we set up this presale. Going forward, they will be almost entirely uninvolved in Obelisk. I have had to allocate about 25% of my time to Obelisk. Slightly more this week, due to the PR meltdown we had from the initial announcement. But most of my time is still going towards Sia. Most people know I work over 100 hours per week (some weeks will eclipse 120), and that a quarter of my time is not a small amount. Zach is closer to 50% Sia, 50% Obelisk at this point. We're expecting that to tone down once the presale is over - much of this time has been spent with banks, with lawyers, with payment processors, and we won't have to do that beyond the initial setup phase. Zach and myself will still be having weekly conversations with every part of the Obelisk supply chain, including the chip designers, chip manufacturers, control board designers, the miner assembly teams, and the fulfillment centers, so even after the presale there will be effort going towards Obelisk. But nobody on the Sia team is doing chip design, nobody is doing control board design, most of the really heavy work is being done by experienced teams and suppliers that we've found and already spent weeks vetting and verifying. We incorporated Obelisk as a separate company precisely so that Obelisk would eventually have a completely separate team. And finally, as Obelisk is wholly owned by Nebulous, a successful hardware company does mean revenue and income for the Sia team. Cryptocurrency mining tends to be low margin, so tens of millions in revenue for Obelisk does not necessarily millions in funding for the Sia team. But it is something, and it will give us more time to get the storage platform to the next levels of maturity.
I know that a lot of you are concerned about the miner presale that we are conducting. I hope that this post has helped to alleviate those concerns. I hope it makes sense why we are doing a public presale, instead of seeking private investment until we have a full prototype. I hope this post has clarified our decisions around payment methods, and around our price point. I hope you feel more confident that this is something we will be able to pull off. And finally, I hope I've reassured you guys that Sia is still our primary focus, and that we haven't suddenly pivoted into being a hardware company. We are ultimately doing this to provide better security to the Sia network. GPU mined coins are frighteningly insecure, and Sia is now large enough where there is serious money on the line. We are doing this to gain security, and also to ensure as much decentralization as possible when it comes to chip manufacture. We are typically viewed as one of the most reputable teams in cryptocurrency, and I know it's why a lot of you are here. We hope that the Sia ASIC that we are going to be manufacturing and selling strengthens this reputation, but ultimately we will not find out until the miners are actually being shipped. We continue to be excited about this new product. We truly do feel that ASICs are the right direction for Sia, and we also feel that we are doing the right thing by bringing the opportunity to own a Sia ASIC to the broader Sia community. We are sorry for the fallout from our sloppy original announcement, and we hope that we have since made up for it. Finally, we hope that you are interested in buying a miner. Even if we only sell a small batch, ASICs are going to utterly dominate the hashrate of Sia going forward. This is an egalitarian sale where everyone has equal opportunity to buy a miner - there's no cap, and we will ensure that small buyers are not shut out by larger buyers in any way.
Given this is the largest set of answers we've had from Josh in a while, and it's quite hard to parse the Shoutbox archive - here it is in its full glory: (edits for formatting) BFL_Josh: Well guys, I had planned on updating everyone with a video of a board hashing here in KC tonight, but I haven't been able to get that together yet, so I'm probably going to have to push it off until tomorrow. We are targeting a start of shipment next week, but I'm not quite ready to commit to that at the moment, given our past estimates. It's imminent, though. Lab_Rat: It hashes???? BFL_Josh: Yes, it hashes BFL_Josh: I just don't have the firmware here in KC yet. enkidu99: nice josh. does this mean you're able to get the next batch of wafers inbound as well? BFL_Josh: I have to check on specifically where they are in the process, I've been primarily focused on the current batch. Chip Geek: We need a few in the hands of customers before April 1 for the bitbet wager... BFL_Josh: I know Chip Geek, I'm going to try to ship out a unit ,at least one, before APril first if it's at all possible. BFL_Josh: Imma pull an Avalon all the way, it's a proven method! Brian Harris: since the existing batch has been pushed back does that mean the subsequent batches will be moved forward? BFL_Josh: Yes Barrett: will there be any increase in the hash/rate as an bonus... BFL_Josh: Probably not Chip Geek: Still within the +/- 10% of the advertised spec though right? BFL_Josh: I'm not sure. We may miss our power targets, that's been part of hte hold up... we think there's a problem with the power consumption and we're trying to figure out where it's having an issue. However, in the interests of time, we are going to be shipping what we have and going back and fixing while we are shipping, just so people can have their units. People are welcome to wait for the revised boards that should help out with the power issue if they want to delay their shipments... (heh, riiiight). BFL_Josh: The power is still far less than any other unit, so it's not like it's something crazy or anything, but it's not 1w/GH and we're trying to locate the source of the power drain. It may require a revision of the substrate and/or the PCB. BFL_Josh: Haha it's WAYYY less than 620 watts even at it's worst. BFL_Josh: What's causing even more consternation is the fact that the wafer we burned for tests runs at far less power than a second wafer we mounted on the BGA package... so it may be a wafer by wafer thing, and sicne we only have two datapoints, it's hard to nail down the issue. We're rolling the other 4 wafers off the line shortly (they may be done already I think) - and that wil at least give us an idea of the power consumption between wafers with 6 data points. Buck’O: if we don't care about the power suck can we just go ahead and get ours ahead of those who do care? :) BFL_Josh: Yes enkidu99: josh would you consider swapping these units for "power optimized units" if we took them as is for now, at a later date (even for some fee)? BFL_Josh: I don't know for sure, but probably. Bogart: You guys didn;t already begin packaging the rest of the wafers? BFL_Josh: the rest of the 6 wafers, we have been holding off on the last 5 layers for the rest of the chips to be sure we don't need to make a tweak in the metal layer due to the power issue. I think we've pretty much settled that hte power issue is NOT in the chip, but somewhere in the substrate or PCB (or if it were in the chip, it's not something that's easily and quickly fixed). MrTeal: LOL... ANy chance you can ship out the first 5 units before the 1st, just for fun? BFL_Josh: I'm going to try, not guarantees though. I would love to see that bet won, believe me. Brian Harris: If you're just riffing about dates, to get orders through the middle of februrary filled, is it going to be like a 1 month gap from the initial batch? BFL_Josh: it'll probably be more like two weeks. Barrett: WILL the single still go 60gh// but with more power and heat..???? BFL_Josh: Depends on the power draw, it may be that the power draw is too high for the board and we need to scale the hashrate back. If that's the case, we'll send multiple units to cover the hashrate difference for orders. Lyke: Do all the devices have the power issues or just specific ones? BFL_Josh: All devices, Lyke... they all use the same board and substrate. 0x3d: So how overclockable will these devices be then? BFL_Josh: Well, that's a good question 0x3d: if we have to scale the hashrate back due to power, the chips themselves may end up more overclockable, but I honestly don't know at this point. Steve Honaker: @Josh if shipping could start next week when is our advance notice to send in our FPGA's? BFL_Josh: Steve: I should know more on that tomorrow [29 Mar] SgtSpike: What's the current power usage? BFL_Josh: We are trying to nail it down. We have some boards at 1.76w, some at 2.5 and some at 4 and one at 6 <- although I think the ones at 4 and 6 have either a broken power regulator and/or a bad power brick, because they power brick is only 120w and it's drawing like 195 watts which is ridiculous. When I get hte firmware here in KC, I'll be running it off of an ATX PSU to eliminate the power brick as the culprit. So you see, this is why the power issue is causing some difficulties. BFL_Josh: Yes, I'm aware that Bitcointalk trolls will have a field day with everything I've just said. Heh. Even a broken power regulator and a bad power brick is still better than an Avalon, but in all honesty, at this point with bitcoin prices at 90 bucks a coin, I'm thinking no one is going to care at hte moment they just want to hash. Which is why we'll be shipping and then improving as we go. b1nary1sfun: well that's all we can ask for....but how many will ship, still the 1/3 plan? BFL_Josh: Yeah, probably... although the 1/3 plan is just dumb in this current climate, but ti's what we've committed to. Bogart: The cooling and the power supply stuff and the traces and everything else will need to handle the extra power. BFL_Josh: If the cooling becomes an issue, like I said, we'd scale it back and ship multiple units. polrpaul: summarize the update for us, please BFL_Josh: Dude seriously, chill out. I'm giving you what I can as far as information goes right now. We are not hashing with anyones units and we will ship as soon as we have product. smracer: So you will get 2 30Gh machines for each 60? BFL_Josh: If need be, yes. X: josh honestly when did you think we will start seeing some units leave the factory? BFL_Josh: I'm really thinking next week, but I will not commit to that until I have some more information. polrpaul: is hte test rig sorted? BFL_Josh: Yes, the test rig is sorted. smith88: I hope you guys get the bug ironed out and do not have to ship multiples. You'll get it; a year from now everybody will look back and see history in the making. BFL_Josh: We will ship whatever we have to to get people hashing at their expected GH. Lab_Rat: well then worst case scenario for a single would be 360W??? BFL_Josh: No, worst case is 195w, but the power systems on the board aren't rated to handle that really I don't think, so we'd back off the hashrate before we'd let it get that high. Lab_Rat: ok thank you. they can handle up to what 120W? BFL_Josh: Yeah I think 120w is a nice comfortable number. It can probably got a bit higher than that, but 195w is probably not where we want to be. onryo: Wont a x4 unit blow the power unit? BFL_Josh: Yeah, so we'd have to back off the hashrate on a per unit basis if that were the case. BFL_Josh: We'd do like 2x 30GH/s singles in stead of 1 60 GH/s one BFL_Josh: We will ship the purchased hashrate regardless of what it ends up costing us. MrTeal: @BFL_Josh, do the LIttle Singles have all of the power supply circuitry populated, and could they run at 30GH/s even if the Big Single can't run at 60GH/s? BFL_Josh: Yes HTL2001: I think he means, if you ordered a big single they might do 2x little singles since the power limit is per board, not per chip BFL_Josh: [HTL2001 is] correct SysRun: Asking again, what are the remaining steps? BFL_Josh: Just mounting, assembly and shipping. smracer: So people that ordered a minirig will get 2 minirigs at half the hashrate? BFL_Josh: yes Crystallas: Are you able to share how many orders are currently committed? BFL_Josh: No, sorry. kaega: Did you say and estimate on the production line output? 100/day? etc? BFL_Josh: I estimate around 400 a day on average in the beginning just to clear back orders. X: josh do we have any idea of if we will reach sept or aus orders in this batch BFL_Josh: In the first 5 wafers? No, I doubt it. jjiimm64: Josh, will the paired down units still have all the chips in them? BFL_Josh: Yes they will kaega: thanks for the reply. How long to get caught up (estimated)? By June? I placed additional order 3 weeks ago or so. BFL_Josh: I should have a better idea on that in the next few days. Barrett Griner IV: Will BFL work through Easter weekend.....to get units out... BFL_Josh: Yes, if need be onryo:if you guys could make a rig in the 10k USD range a lot more people might be intested.... BFL_Josh: I agree 100%. I have been floating that for awhile, but we've been so focused on otehr thigns, we haven't gotten down that road yet. oldbushie: so... 300 whats a day? boards? chips? shipments? BFL_Josh: 400 completed units a day Barrett Griner IV: So at this point the 8 Chip single will now be 2x 4 chip singles....will that continue....or til the bug is fixed... Ivan Frimmel: BUG? BFL_Josh: There is no bug BFL_Josh: Sorry I don't have the video guys, I really wanted to float that tonight. Lyke: would have been great to see video - Guess we'll see tomorrow? BFL_Josh: Yeah, tomorrow should be good I hope! SysRun: Josh, every time you use the word 'should' you are now required to put a bitcent in the 'should' jar. BFL_Josh: Not a bad idea
Reverse engineering of Avalon ASIC chip. Work in progress
Howdy Bitcoin community, I am an individual located in Europe, who owns several Avalon first batch devices. I'm well versed in the field of electronics and integrated circuit design/analysis. Currently I'm in the process of contacting http://chipworks.com to get an approximate price for the task of fully reverse engineer the inner integrated circuits of Avalon ASIC chip, in order to replicate it. Here's a picture of the board i intend to send to chipworks http://imgur.com/lsO5Mru. I'm just in the initial phase of preparing communication with them thus i don't have yet extimations as for the size of the investment. After reverse engineering is done and set of photomasks are extracted, a batch of test chips will be commissioned to a fab foundry, along with the photomasks . When test chips are delivered tests with will be conducted for several PCB board designs, based on the opensource specifications released by Avalon. I have a substantial amount of funds to invest myself but i'm looking for partnerships to find suitable business partners and build a serious business out of this. The final goal is to mass produce an Avalon chip clone for private use and bring up blade-like devices to the final tune of several hundred Terahashes, a longer term goal is to further apply features miniaturization and design optimizations, to bring up performances, and lower power draw to the current ASIC design. Is there interest in this, or am i the only crazy thinker who wants to go through this steps ? Cheers! and thanks in advance for your responses! EDIT Thanks for your awesome responses! Of course, since i mentioned i'm seeking for partnerships, i feel i need to add that all formal agreement about shares distributions shall be previously discussed, and accepted by the board of eventual investors . Of course, if there are any interested investors, there would be a proper escrow setup for funds collection, perhaps with a trusted forum member who will handle, for a fee, deposits from investors in FIAT/BTC, exchange BTC for FIAT when its needed to pay suppliers, and also handle suppliers payment under escrow. Full financial statements would be released reliably, making this a fully transparent venture. By the way right now, as its clear from my original post, i'm now seeking people with solid skills to build a team, not really focusing on investors right now. But i would appreciate some "chime-in".
Hey guys, Not sure if you are aware, but Josh from BFL labs has advised units to begin shipping end of april. (Hopefully) https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/692-bfl-asic-status-3.html There have been further annoucements and talk in the shoutbox regarding this.. information seems to be all over the place. so this is what I know so far: 18/04/13: At this stage they are in the final stage of testing and fine tuning the power consumption ( predictions showed it to be in the range of 1GH/J but its now looking closer to 170MH/J ) This will also likely improve over time but is still miles ahead of Avalon and GPU miners. Minirig is no longer available for purchase as they cannot fit it in the case that it was intended for so after the Single SC is finished they will look into the minirig again, But the minirig is composed of Single SC's that are running on a higher clock due to more optimised cooling. The chips are FINE. The delay is re-engeneering the power system on the boards to handle to extra consumption. IMHO I think they will start the shipping process on end of april, They will start with the Jalapeno's and work their way up. Still no ETA for minirig though.. You may have heard about the tour on reddit http://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/1c3hyc/toured_butterflylabs_a_few_hours_ago/ This was confirmed by Josh but he also made a valid point, "Why would we pay staff to stand around watching" Once the shipping process begins they expect to ship 400 units per day. I would say the first week would be 200 units per day average while they sort out all the kinks. But I have high hopes. UPDATE: Photos of Mini-Rig: http://imgur.com/a/Uanjr#0 Please note these may be an older model, But give you a better idea of how a slightly larger PCB will affect the production.. If you have ordered from BFL Labs, Please fill in your details here so we can publicly track how many have been delivered etc. UPDATE 2: Found this on BFL website. BFL will make 400 units/day. 2,000 units/week. 8,000 units/month. That means: ->4 months = 32,000 units ->5 months = 40,000 units ->6 months = 48,000 units UPDATE 3: There are many photos and some misc information on BFL and the ASIC miners below. Forum registration is required for some photos. https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/1099-orders-shipping-pictures-facility-when-my-stuff-here-why-delays-shipping.html UPDATE 4 (2/5): There is a BFL update email going out now, so check your inbox. Also, Josh has been posting stuff in the last 12 hours, so I'll be sending out some quotes shortly. BFL_Josh on order confirmation: I'd wait awhile before trying. It's not like we're going to cancle your order today. You got 10 days or so... BFL_Josh - Yeah Product server is dying. We are doing this so that we can be sure everyone understands that the power usage is more than we planned. We don't want to get into a situation where we ship something out that someone isn't expecting. BFL_Josh - Product server is overloaded. Wait awhile to confirm your orders. No orders are in imminent danger of being refunded without approval. Clicking accept does not change your place in the order queue. BFL_Sabina - When the website is back up, please log in to the website and proceed with the confirmation process there. Confirmation by email is not accepted. If you check the products page you will see the Single SC is much larger than originally intended and this confirms what I was saying earlier about the larger PCB. Will update when I hear further.. I would say they are staggering the emails as their website is overloaded and I don't have an email personally yet.. however this is all in the last 2 hours.. so we shall just have to wait and see... Check back here for more updates. I will update as soon as it is available. Find the information helpfull? Tips are appreciated :)
Here another European order from: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=188768.0 Group Buy Europe [Nederland] Today at 02:01:27 AM #1 Group Buy Europe [Nederland] updated: 27th of April I. Group Buy Information We will order 1 batch (10,000) chips from Avalon at a cost of 780 BTC Product description: the only payment accepted is Bitcoin. the chips being sold are packaged and tested. the lead time on the chips is 9 to 10 weeks. made to order from TSMC foundry and then packaged and shipped. the minimum order quantity is 10,000 chips and the maximum order quantity is 200,000. the chips are identical to those in Avalon, clocking 282Mh/s per chip. the password is “I understand and agree”. communication protocol, reference board design provided in early May. everything will be open source from FPGA to PCB design. we do not offer technical support of any kind, this is final. if you do not know what to do with the packaged chips, please do not purchase. http://store.avalon-asics.com/?product=avalon-asic-chips-10000 II. Why another group buy ? zefir and ragingazn628 offer a great deal, but I am convinced it will take them some time to ship all their orders, besides this I think burnin and new-asics well be very busy with assembling ASICS. Thus alternatives and decentralization would be very useful to many miners. III. Price 10,000 chips (excl. shipping) cost 780 BTC => 1 chips = 0.078 BTC As I am going to import as a private person I assume import tax to the Netherlands will be 21 % (I know it sucks). 21 % of 780 BTC = 163.8 BTC Total Costs: 943.8 BTC To make it easier and to pay for my effort and expenses I will charge 0.1 BTC per chip. (0.09438 chip costs + import taxes, 0.00562 fee) Avalon chips 780 BTC 21 % tax 163.8 BTC Fee: 56.2 BTC Total: 1000 BTC IV. Shipping You will have two options, you can personally pick up your order in the following locations: Brussels Amsterdam (evtl. I will add another city, if there is a demand) or we will organize shipping via DHL, UPS (you will have to pay shipping fee) V. Please post following information in this thread: N Number of chips B Bitcoins transfered Bitcoin address Forum nickname Example: 200, 20,3594ter9ffwejiergij31sdsfd, MasterBoy89 Please only send your Bitcoins with a wallet you control ! You rather can send your BTC directly to this address: 1L79nCEzcPRFFKTk59QBRfgWDvgg75hDwr but if you're more comfortable we also can use escrow. VI. Trust Why should you trust me ? I don't know, but if you want to meet me I will be at the Bitcoin meeting in Driebergen on May 3rd, where we can discuss and you can ask me nearly any question. VII. Assembly I guess burnin/Neo-asics will be very busy thus the plan would be to build our own community assembler team. Preferably located in the BeNeLux. Anyone interest in taking the lead ?
Alibaba.com offers 8,836 the avalon products. About 32% of these are Blockchain Miners. A wide variety of the avalon options are available to you, such as output interface type, video memory capacity, and rating power. The Avalon 741 inherently is simply an upgrade on the Avalon 721. Naturally, it wasn’t expected to sway too much from the original features adopted by the Avalon 721. However, the 741 seems to be on a different path altogether. It has managed to create a unique space for itself in the market and is rapidly climbing the popularity charts. DIY – BitCoin mining ASIC Avalon Gen 2 A3255-Q48, PCB 16 chips – 26GH/s Temmuz 4, 2020; BÀI 1 – Forex là gì? Thuận lợi và khó khăn khi tham gia Forex? | CHN PRO TRADING Temmuz 4, 2020; Bitcoin Mining Pro (Testimonial) how i made money online Temmuz 4, 2020; FIZ R$6.215,00 NO FOREX [AULA DA OPERAÇÃO] Temmuz 4, 2020 The Avalon 6 ASIC Bitcoin miner is the latest in Bitcoin hardware from Canaan-Creative/Avalon. Much like the Avalon 4, the new housing makes for a streamlined cooling and setup method. Canaan-Creative, who resurrected the damaged Avalon brand, has worked hard on these next gen ASICs as well as their customer service. The 21 Bitcoin Computer isn’t considered as a Bitcoin miner, however, it plugins to your computer via USB. In terms of $/hash rate, it’s not a very good choice. Having to use this option is not as popular as such since the Bitcoin was only profitable in the early years before the competition has risen over the years.